Head Count

I can message her on yahoo and see if she'll be joining us if you want?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umDr0mPuyQc

nuff said !

I will be playing a Jedi Consular - healer dude - don't know on how that will work specifically until I see the advanced classes. (and of course a trooper D'hors)

As always, I will do everything.

I do not think the guild needs a specific focus as far as game content is concerned. Camaraderie and efficiency without bickering should be our focus - aka - being a team. So when we do tackle PvP, they will know we've been there. When we do PvE, we will rock. Raids, we will show em how it's done just like we did for Hoth in SWG.

We don't need 5 raid teams all going out and only doing super uber raids or PvP or even PvE - I prefer not to divy it up.

What needs to happen is we have nightly activities, a primary one and a secondary one. These might be differentiated later in the game as Raid/mission help. Or even throw on a tertiary objective with PvP in the middle. Just something so that ALL people feel a part of the community of Saberwing and not left out or neglected. Anyone should be able to fit into the 2-3 activities per evening. This is what will make us a growing, yet stable guild in TOR.

The other issue I've noticed is we rely a little much on self-starters. We really need to start delegating responsibility and building up leaders in game. Say for instance, you know a newer member or two really likes raids, then have them together with the current raid leader plan raids together. Until eventually we have about 6-10 people who can manage the different raids with more being trained up each time. Same goes for PvP, PvE stuff, and recruiting. Building up leaders by delegating power to them incrementally until they are effective at their craft. This way you avoid vaccuums when a member has to leave for a time.

An this is why D'hors is a teacher :buddies: . Good points .


An yeah Cill I'll be doing a different character name then I used in swg . I've a few that come to mind depending on races that are playable with Jedi Councilar .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umDr0mPuyQc

nuff said !

:tongue:

Ya I have no desire to put work into TOR =P As long as it's fun to get on a few nights a week and play with some sabers then I'll be playing it.

Yeah, I don't want it to become work either. It won't become work if we properly train peeps for runs and delegate authority wisely. Takes the load off of everyone's shoulders.

Of course I will be playing.

Smuggler for Kirby for sure. If I get an alt maybe Trooper. I'm really trying to avoid the glowbat thing this time around. Will do so for sure with my main, but my alt may end up Jedi. I dunno.

Agreed on the previous comments. We can figure out what our plans will be as we know more about the game, but we have never lost our focus of just being a good group of old friends playing some games.

" It won't become work if we properly train peeps for runs and delegate authority wisely."

That's just it. Here is how you designate a raid group:

Player A wants to go on a raid. Player posts on board with hey I need x,y, and z classes for a raid on x date at y date.

Raid formed.

I'll be going Bounty Hunter for the first char, Jedi Knight for the second, and if possible, Sith Inquisitor for the third

" It won't become work if we properly train peeps for runs and delegate authority wisely."

That's just it. Here is how you designate a raid group:

Player A wants to go on a raid. Player posts on board with hey I need x,y, and z classes for a raid on x date at y date.

Raid formed.

As a mathematician, I cringe when you use the same variables for different things. :doubt:

It isn't forming raids that I'm concerned about. It is the knowledge and efficiency to maintain our good name. Nor am I concerned about the bulk of us should we throw together a group to run one.

The concern is you have too many of one of these two groups: those who know the ins and the outs of the raid - the leaders, and you have those who are tagging along - the followers.

If you have too many followers it becomes a management nightmare because the one dude who normally leads that raid is having a tough semester, gone for vacation, is playing Yoda Stories, etc. then who picks up the baton to lead that raid if they haven't taken some peeps under their wing to train them how to do it?

I'm really not concerned about having too many leaders - as long as they understand we play for fun; winning/losing comes with it and the relationships with the people you travel with are more important than any particular outcome. Irrate leadership is just tyrany and we usually have our parents/teachers/bosses for that.

If people want to take initiative they will - you can't train that into a person.

It's not all that hard, google whatever it is you're about to do and read what you need then get the people you need to do it. If all of us are playing I doubt we'll run into any shortage of leader-types.

I'm not talking about training a person to take initiative. I am talking about training a person to be able to assist with adequate knowledge regarding something they have already shown a high interest in.

When we get some more recruits as Sabers: some like PvP, some raids, and some just want to run missions. We set them up with the people who generally do those things respectively. Not all of them are as competent as they could be, some of them are only 16 and I don't even want to consider all I didn't know then.

All I'm saying we really need is an apprenticeship/mentor program in TOR if we really want to have an impact and grow. Fitting people where they like it best and equipping them the best we can, including responsibilities.

For instance, your prowess in PvP in SWG Nis. Say two peeps join SBR, they want to tag along. One is for the ride, one is in it for the long haul and wants to kick some Empire rear. You give the hints/tips/pointers of group strategies, organization, management. Eventually when it comes time to PvP, you and your new comrade are able to work together and seperately in tandem - both leading squads to victory. This in turn increases our renown and allow for growth.

But should the process of pursuing the passions of guildmates ever die, then we as a guild will die in TOR. And this will happen easily if we don't have enough people with the knowledge/availability to lead. Not everyone in SBR will google a raid for info.

It isn't that we are looking for leaders-types. But people with the ability to learn and to grow so that should a group need a leader with the knowledge of what needs to be done - they can step up.

Here's the thing: I could write everything you possibly needed to know for PvP in a paragraph - at the most two. And most of that would be pure common sense that anyone who thought about it for any amount of time would come up with. After that its just experience at doing it. The question is will they have the initiative to do so.

The answer will sadly be mostly: no.

As far as PvE goes you just Google it and follow the directions to be honest (unless of course you're on the bleeding edge of it, in which case its all trial and error).

The hardest part of doing anything in an MMO isn't actually doing that activity, its getting the initiative together to go and do it. A lot of that is in the developers hands, hopefully the game is designed well and the carrots at the end of the stick are worth pursuing after.

My problem has not been a lack of people (with the desire to do something).

It has always been a lack of competent people.

My problem has not been a lack of people (with the desire to do something).

It has always been a lack of competent people.

That needs to be addressed more so by who exactly we recruit. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink - we need people who are decent players who can learn.

When grouping we should probably fill the group out even if it isn't necessary. That means if there are 5 of us on wanting to do something and the max group size is 6 we should probably fill that last spot up. Even if the content is easily do-able for the 5 of us. Watch how well said person plays, and if they're cool and are actually doing their job in the group try to recruit them possibly.

One of the other bigger things is to befriend folks in other guilds so we have people we can message to fill out remaining spots in a raid/call for backup in PvP. Those list of contacts will do like-wise for us. Its how CATS was successful - they might not have had all the people needed to do content within the guild but they had plenty of people willing to come with them or bring them along to do it. Plus whenever PvP broke out, we heard about it fairly quickly.

I agree with Nis. Its all about who you let in. At one point in time it was just about having warm bodies capable of loading up XvT. In that case, there does have to be a lot of baby sitting. The vets are mad at the noobs for dragging along, and the noobs are mad at the vets for not keeping things fresh and interesting. I say forget the teaching. Only allow people in who are serious, mature, and self motivated. Frankly that's why I'm against recruiting. Self motivated people will seek out a group they want to join.

All in all, leadership will default to whomever is the most interested and capable. The person most capable of administrating is going to be the defacto guild leader who keeps the in game roster current and welcomes new members and what not. Your strongest group PvP player is going to be your defacto pvp leader. It will just happen. Its really quite amazing how a system can sort itself out as long as there are no legitimate troublemakers.